Brandon: so like I said, better episode than I thought it would be.
Brandon: big question of the day: why did Ben kill Locke?
No kidding
Why didn't he let Locke kill himself?
I have two theories in that way:
Brandon: something vital changed
Amy: Either Ben wanted to know what he knew and then found out he knew too much (how cliche) and therefore killed him
Or something with him being able to come back to life means he can't kill himself...
Why did Ben look so angry at the time, though?
Did he find out later that he actually needed Locke to get back on the island?
And he's like, "Crap. I killed him. Oh well, I guess I'll just steal his body with this van I have..."
Brandon: ok one thing at a time
Brandon: Option A: Possible. The only thing that changed was that Locke revealed he knew of Hawking.
Amy: But why would that upset him so much?
Brandon: you think Ben looks angry as he kills Ben? Or is it just the extreme focus needed to strangle someone to death?
Amy: I think he looks at least a little angry
Brandon: we'll get back to that
Brandon: Your Option B: No, because I don't think Ben expected Locke to resurrect.
Brandon: He says "I'm really going to miss you, John."
Amy: Hence the Thomas story to Jack
Brandon: why say that if he anticipates seeing him again on the Island in like a day?
Brandon: ooh but I forgot about the Doubting Thomas stuff.
I think it was a story about himself
Brandon: Maybe Ben is just the writers' vehicle for setting it up... he doesn't know about it himself.
a good possibility
Brandon: and re: why bring Locke back to the Island...
Amy: He found out something later that changed his mind - I'm guessing Eloise talked to him
Brandon: the prevailing thought right now is that Ben killed Locke after Locke revealed he knew about Hawking either because A.) Ben did not know about Hawking before that moment, and once he knew she was the key to getting back he had no use for Locke OR B.) Locke was not supposed to know about Hawking, and once it is revealed that he did, Ben had to kill him, as a rival for control of the Island.
Brandon: also: Ben then decides to use Locke's body as the "Christian" on the flight, HOWEVER there's a good possibility he doesn't know that Christian was raised somehow into some vague sense of living. He's never seen him.
That's true
That makes sense
Brandon: so I'm guessing he'll be shocked when he wakes up from his plane-crash injury coma and sees John staring at him.
Talk about nightmare coming true
But if Locke is a proxy for Christian, why did he resurrect rather than come into the sense of being that Christian is?
Brandon: Locke is a chosen Island protector like Richard, Christian, not.
also: Ben says once you turn the wheel you can't ever go back. He and Locke do go back... but end up on the Hydra island. Does the Hyrda not count, or is Ben lying (again)?
Amy: But why can Christian come back as a ghost or whatever?
Or the island changed its mind
?
It would kind of make sense that the Hydra kind of doesn't count -
Brandon: no idea why Christian was raised like he was. Maybe the Island can do freaky stuff with bodies that are dead upon arrival.
but the Hyrda moves with the main Island.
Amy: And is considered part of the island by Dharma, at least
Brandon: but they aren't Island
Brandon: and as my latest poll discusses, who is the good guy here? Widmore, or Ben? Each of them are excellent at at least playing the good guy, even when you know their body of work doesn't point to that being the case.
Amy: I think they both have agendas and do what it takes to get it done, whether being good or bad goes with it at the time or not
Brandon: right, so if you're Locke, who do you want to help? Whose agenda more closely mirrors your own?
Amy: Do we know what their agendas are?
I think they both want control of the island
Brandon: ok but to what end?
Amy: Widmore wants to commercialize it, I think, and just have sheer power of the island
I think Ben has more respect for the island and keeping it safe, but he likes the power, too
Brandon: so you go with Ben?
Amy: I'm going to say yes, even though he's super manipulative and we see his true colors, which are a bit freaky
Brandon: also, he kills Abbadon, which GRR
but I guess we found out all we needed to? He works for Widmore. He wanted to get Locke on the Island. The end.
Amy: Ha ha - because he was answering questions?
Pretty much - that seemed like his purpose
Brandon: so Widmore wants Locke on the Island, Ben doesn't.
doesn't that make Widmore the one to follow if you're John?
Amy: I though Widmore just doesn't want Locke to die
Brandon: well, he gets Abbadon to send Locke on the Walkabout, remember?
and he says something about helping Locke convince the others to go back, Locke included.
Amy: The walkabout thing is true - but how does Locke know Widmore is telling the truth this time?
but he fixes his leg and gives him the means to go anywhere in the world
I guess what it comes down to is: do you stick with the person who wants the best for the island or the person who will get you there?
Brandon: turns out, Locke kinda waffled between both and ended up back there anyway.
:)
Lucky for him
I felt bad for him again - I haven't felt that for awhile
Brandon: when he's all despondent before he tries to off himself?
Brandon: Mandi and I disagree on that one.
Amy: And how he's just trying to do what's best for everyone
But no one will listen to him
Brandon: is he sad because he feels like he's failed and decides to just end it all? Or is he just at the end of his rope (haha) and decides to follow Richard's advice because he feels like there's nothing else to do?
Amy: Yeah - I think he's trying to fulfill what Richard tells him, but I also think he's truly despondent
Doesn't feel like he's part of the story anymore
all that time spent where the Others kidnapped him, and now no one cares if he lives or dies.
Brandon: did we talk about this already? About how Walt is special, but not like the Others thought he was?
Brandon: I think that's a big thing. The Others in Season 2 or whenever find out that Walt is special.
so they kidnap him, thinking maybe he should be their leader?
then later it shows them all being COMPLETELY FREAKED OUT by the kid, which means they had no idea what he could do.
and he was definitely not what they hoped he was.
Amy: Which makes me laugh
Nope
so this brings up the question: what is the deal with Walt?
Amy: Which is ironic, considering it was kind of the island that wanted him
Brandon: was it, though? Did Jacob want him or did Ben or Richard do it on his won?
own
Amy: I dunno - does Locke know something everyone else doesn't, or did he really just want to visit Walt?
Somebody's going to have to take over when Locke or Ben dies
Amy: Which makes me want to ask why Alpert isn't in charge all the time
Brandon: Walt just represents all of the thousands of loose ends the writers now have 1.5 seasons to tie up.
Brandon: Maybe Alpert isn't special (beyond his ability to remain 28)
Amy: Ha ha - yeah, that's nothing
Brandon: Mandi and I have commented more than once that his function is much like an old noble in a kingdom where the new prince is in charge, but doesn't know what he's doing.
the noble acts in an advisory role as much as he can, because he knows how to take care of the kingdom, but the power all resides with the spoiled new kid.
Amy: Why does he continue to do it?
Because he's not royalty?
That seems dumb because he's ageless
Jacob has not deemed him to be the leader, so he can't be the leader.
but he is loyal to the Island
so he stays
Amy: He is the one who is always talking about destiny and not trying to change it - maybe his old age has helped him realize his place and to be find with it
of course, then we go back to the idea that Jacob is a prisoner.
Brandon: his "help me" and the theory that the volcanic ash around his cabin makes a cage of some sort.
of someone. Usually theorized to be Ben.
Amy: But then Ben says the island is displeased with him and he has to leave - that doesn't free him?
Brandon: maybe it did. We haven't seen or heard anything about Jacob since.
Amy: Again - I think it's pointless to have so much power and yet allow yourself to be confined
1. We don't know what power Jacob has.
2. We don't even know who or what Jacob is.
Brandon: so Widmore says he was the leader of the Island for more than three decades
say 1954-1992
he's what... 50-something?
Yeah
Penny was born on-island
Brandon: 50 when he gets off Island, 70 or so now
yeah, bottom line, Penny was either born on Island
OR
adopted, like Alex.
Brandon: also, if you look at Penny with a "she was born on-Island" lens, she appears to know more than she lets on.
Amy: Yes - she found the island, after all
And is pretty against Desmond having anything to do with it
So she's like Charlotte
Except not wanting to really find the island again
If Penny was born on the island, though, she had to have been conceived off the island... how would that work into all of this?
ReplyDeleteIt seems like the "conceived on Island = death" thing is relatively new, no? I mean, Ben only brought in a fertility specialist to work on the problem like five years ago.
ReplyDelete